 Production rules... ? |
Digital Cause 
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Registration Date: 06-07-2006
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Hey all, this is an awesome site.
Been makin DnB for almost a year now, but this question is always in the back of my head... are there any rules..
Im not talkin about beats and all that stuff, im talking about things like Bass levels, amount of compression needed etc. Now on one level its all good to get your tunes sounding nice, and as close to whatever commercially produced cds you may be listening to, but what should I consider before say sending them into a record level, with the anticipation that they may be played on a club system.... the last thing i want is for them to say no because it wont translate well onto a large system.
Mastering engineer gets levels for vinyl and bla bla, but are there any golden rules? -not putting hats on the same steps,
- bass levels
-amount of compression
- reverb on certain elements, ie. bass
- is any type of bass you think sounds ok , really ok
- or for that matter, is any sound you think sounds cool ok?
cheers dudes
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06-07-2006 16:10 |
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Surya
The Robot
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| quote: |
Originally posted by Digital Cause
-amount of compression |
As for compression I can say this: I don't like compression on the master channel, I never do that. Just compress things you thing need compression. You should never use compression to fix problems you can fix with EQing.
| quote: |
Originally posted by Digital Cause
- reverb on certain elements, ie. bass |
I often hear beginning producers down everything in reverb. I used to do that to. It sounds sweet and gives a wide feel to sounds. But it aslo makes your overall mixdown muddy. Now I hardly use any reverb anymore. Most drum 'n' bass sounds pretty dry, you know, and that's how I like it. I tend to put some reverb on pads or effects, but never on bass or drums.
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"In dnb you should make people jump not swim"
- Pieter Frenssen 2004
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06-07-2006 17:30 |
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Digital Cause
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and I guess my biggest question is is there a standard level to which the pros would set their relative volume levels?
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www.myspace.com/mysterious1000
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06-07-2006 18:43 |
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Digital Cause
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I tend to put a touch of gated reverb on snares, and in some cases a fair bit on the hats, just cos i think with a lot of hats it sounds good and gives the riddim a bit more depth..... I wanna know any hints bout reverbing bass though, that would be awesome
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www.myspace.com/mysterious1000
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06-07-2006 18:45 |
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TechDiff
Hetty Jakes Pretentious Cheese Wog
Registration Date: 14-06-2005
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I honestly dont think its worth worrying about that sort of thing too much. If sone one was going to release your stuff they'd get a mastering engineer to sort the mix out for you. Obviously there is only so much they can do but you'd be supprised at just how much they can change the sound of a mix.
Its just up to you to try and get it sound as best as you can.
You really shouldnt worry about rules etc.. thats the type of thing that stops a genre from progressing and instead grows stale. Stuff like getting you bass at the right level is pretty easy, the main important thing is to mix at loud volume. If your too quiet then you wont be able to pick up on all the sub frequencies and will end up turning up the bass to compensate for this. Sure enought when the track gets played loud the bass will be way too loud.
Another thing you should try, is to Try and remove the low frequencies from other sounds like lead synths, effects, snares etc... So that the only real sub is from the bass synth and kick drum. This will make it a lot easier to get a nice clean sub in your tune. Otherwise all the little bits of low frequencies leaking through will mess it all up especially when played at volume.
As for compression and reverb. I think its better to use them quite spareingly. Mater compression is definately a no no when your writing a tune, thats something for the mastering engineer to worry about. If your doing it yourself for demos the dont over do it. You can really flatten the punch on drums etc and it'll reduce the impact of the tune as a whole.
Reverb is a bitch to get right though. I also used to pile it on everything when I started producing tunes since it does add something to them. But it also can really mud up a mix. I much prefere a track when there is a lot going on but there is a nice sence of space between all the parts, this is partly down to cleaver use of revedrb but mostly its about EQ and getting the levels right, be very careful with reverb since its also very easy to carried away with. This will result in a very messy sounding mix, with no real definition.
I'm amzed at how much a good mastering engineer can do. A friend of mine makes psy-trance and he recently was asked for a track for a compilation CD. The track was professionally mastered. He played me the 2 different versions, before and after and I was stunned. It was a good mix to start with. But the bass was a bit too loud before, some of the parts didnt have much definition, and the high end like hats n cymbals was kinda messy. But afterwards everything was sorted, the bass was at a perfect level, eveything came through so well, and not to sound cliche, but it had a really professional sheen to it.
I guess that ultimately you just have to do your best, if you keep doing it you'll get better. Its definately worth getting some decent monitors since this'll make it a lot easier. I got some new monitors about 4-5 months ago, and as Ive got used to them, my mixes have been getting a lot better.
The main thing to worry about is the ideas rather than the mixes. I'd like to think that if a record label wanted to release a track of yours that wasnt quite up to grade in terms of mix down, they'd help you to get it to that starndard, either by offering advice, or getting it professionally mastered.
Good luck.
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06-07-2006 18:52 |
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djfreemc
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The only important rules in making music are the ones your ears tell you.
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The mysteries of the distorted snare...
Can't win if u don't play
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06-07-2006 19:02 |
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Surya
The Robot
Registration Date: 04-11-2002
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| quote: |
Originally posted by Digital Cause
and I guess my biggest question is is there a standard level to which the pros would set their relative volume levels? |
It's not like there's a scale for that. And as TechDiff said: a studio technician will master them properly if they're gonna be released.
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"In dnb you should make people jump not swim"
- Pieter Frenssen 2004
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06-07-2006 19:58 |
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thechronic
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Registration Date: 01-11-2002
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Best advice I can give is to listen a lot to music of professional producers, and compare it to your work, listen if your track has not too much or too little bass or high end, listen if the leads are not too loud, if it has too much reverb etc.
You can learn a lot by just listening to the masters 
And if you apply an effect to something, be it reverb, compression, EQ or anything else, try to compare it to the sound without effect by putting the effect in bypass, and listen if it is really improving the sound.
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07-07-2006 15:04 |
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D2o
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| quote: |
Originally posted by thechronic
Best advice I can give is to listen a lot to music of professional producers, and compare it to your work, listen if your track has not too much or too little bass or high end, listen if the leads are not too loud, if it has too much reverb etc.
You can learn a lot by just listening to the masters
And if you apply an effect to something, be it reverb, compression, EQ or anything else, try to compare it to the sound without effect by putting the effect in bypass, and listen if it is really improving the sound. |
Wise words
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07-07-2006 15:53 |
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Muad'Dib
Andrejnalin
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07-07-2006 19:36 |
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B-complex
Wicked Producer
Registration Date: 07-04-2004
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I'm not so sure that every label can afford your tunes to be professionaly mastered, maybe the biggest can but plenty of the smaller cannot, if you want to be really "pro" in drum&bass one of the important thing in your art is also engineering like it or not, if somebody is playing guitar he knows various techniques can play various things etc, it's his art as a guitarist, in d&b genre one of art is sound engineering mixing and mastering. Proper mixdown is most important for your sound, mastering options with just software are quite limited, what I usually do with mixdown is light limitation to get rid of unimportant peaks without affecting dynamics, maybe little bit of eq and harmonic enhancers important rule here is less is more.
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08-07-2006 10:22 |
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