 Oh man! Can't they just kill the poort things first? |
Surya 
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16-06-2006 09:51 |
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Glim
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oh fuckin hell, this is pure evil man!!!!!
i made my self watch the whole clip and i dont think i'll be eating breakfast today for one thing.
is this a cultural difference or something coz skinning them alive is like the most cruelist thing to do man, there simply is no need.
at points there are plenty of people in the street around sounding extreamly calm and at ease with it (or so it seems), there all a bunch of dirty fuckin cunts, i'd take lots of pleasure skinning them alive - fuckin scum
seeing that animaal still breathing with no skin and its eye lashes on it along with tuffs of fur on its paws, bearly existing makes me so fuckin angry, shit man there is some horrible unthinkable stuff that goes on in our world, im sure this is just the tip of the iceburg but mate it needs to be brought to peoples attention..
i agree with animall testing for the sake of medical science (whatever small benefits ae gained), but this is purely barbaric dirty street dealing scum that should be tortured trust me i dont even want to type the things i can think of doing to them
a harsh clip surya but fairplay for showing the headz here - awareness is everything
DONT WATCH IF YOU'VE JUS EATEN OR GOING TO SHORTLY
peace
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16-06-2006 10:09 |
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broadside
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yeah really nasty.
but just to play devil's advocacate:
1) its not as if animals are any nicer to each other, if you watch any nature programs, they are always doing sick shit, its just the way nature is. don't see why people should expect us to be different, other than the fact that we mostly live in urban bubbles nowadays, and so pretty much anything (not that that was pretty much anything) shock us e.g. just any animal getting killed and eaten.
2)Why can't they just kill the poor things first indeed? From a pragmatic point of view it would make sense. That clip looks like they're deliberately being incompetent and evil, but it doesn't mean that thats how all these animals are being killed, and it doesn't mean that all animal killers have similar standards. that clip has to be the exception rather than the rule.
The only reason I'm saying this, is that where I live at the moment they have some medical research facilities with animals and that nearby, and of course that attracts all the extreme animal rights nutters. These people tend to be violent, ignorant and intensely hypocritical. Way too long to go into the whys and wherefores now - but i think a lot of it is to do with pepople using extremely unrepresentative footage to just churn up peoples emotions.
Anyway, sorry to be controversial, but the thread was there to be discussed i imagine - and its something i feel strongly about, because im always being accosted by people weilding similar and more dubious images and trying to be intimidating, emotional blackmail starts pissing you off after a while.
Btw, just to be balanced, heres some other stuff about animal rights (?) abuses that i got sent today http://tvyil.greenpeaceweb.org/default.a...m=57&loadcat=11
its about klling whales, its says its pretty sick, only watched a bit of tho, doesnt look as bad.
This post has been edited 1 time(s), it was last edited by broadside: 16-06-2006 15:12.
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16-06-2006 15:06 |
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Glim
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| quote: |
[i]
but it doesn't mean that thats how all these animals are being killed
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i was commenting on that one clip alone, not jumping on the save the planet and the animals band wagon bro, as far as im concerned the people in that clip shold be shot or preferably tortured first, my statment was totally based on watching that clip, i dont comment on the whole picture as i dont know or see the whole picture, as for animals doing things in their own enviroment i know what ur saying but we have more intelligence than the survival instinct man, so yes it IS still wrong what we're doing coz there is no need and no gain to us by keeping them alive as we skin them.
most of or the stereotypical animal rights campaigner is agressive, rude, violent, dirty and basis their argument as you say on one over played clip and often not giving a fair argument on the issue
i do like how its got us talking and i feel for you having to put up with those mad nutters campaigning nearby 
hahaa
peace
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16-06-2006 15:45 |
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Glim
Stuck In The Late Nineties
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| quote: |
but it doesn't mean that thats how all these animals are being killed
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i was commenting on that one clip alone, not jumping on the save the planet and the animals band wagon bro, as far as im concerned the people in that clip shold be shot or preferably tortured first, my statment was totally based on watching that clip, i dont comment on the whole picture as i dont know or see the whole picture, as for animals doing things in their own enviroment i know what ur saying but we have more intelligence than the survival instinct man, so yes it IS still wrong what we're doing coz there is no need and no gain to us by keeping them alive as we skin them.
most of or the stereotypical animal rights campaigner is agressive, rude, violent, dirty and basis their argument as you say on one over played clip and often not giving a fair argument on the issue
i do like how its got us talking and i feel for you having to put up with those mad nutters campaigning nearby
hahaa
peace
edit: accidentally fucked up my last post, sorry...
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This post has been edited 1 time(s), it was last edited by Glim: 16-06-2006 15:46.
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16-06-2006 15:46 |
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Surya
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| quote: |
Originally posted by broadside
but just to play devil's advocacate:
1) its not as if animals are any nicer to each other, if you watch any nature programs, they are always doing sick shit, its just the way nature is. don't see why people should expect us to be different, other than the fact that we mostly live in urban bubbles nowadays, and so pretty much anything (not that that was pretty much anything) shock us e.g. just any animal getting killed and eaten. |
I think humans are capable of having a different awareness of the suffering of the animals where as other animals just follow their instincts. We have the choice to ease their suffering.
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16-06-2006 15:47 |
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cynik
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| quote: |
Originally posted by broadside
but just to play devil's advocacate:
1) its not as if animals are any nicer to each other, if you watch any nature programs, they are always doing sick shit, its just the way nature is. don't see why people should expect us to be different, other than the fact that we mostly live in urban bubbles nowadays, and so pretty much anything (not that that was pretty much anything) shock us e.g. just any animal getting killed and eaten. |
Lol! Did you ever see animals skinning each other?? not. but not because you're living in a city, it's because it's not how nature works.
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16-06-2006 16:02 |
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equipped
tired
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the pita dude filming,.. should have filmed himself skining the china man alive,...or at least shootin him point blank,..an eye for an eye i say.
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16-06-2006 21:42 |
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TechDiff
Hetty Jakes Pretentious Cheese Wog
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Year... Cheers for posting that. Really made my day.
I got about 20 seconds into it and gad to stop watching.
The unfortunate thing about this is not so much what is happening, but the fact that people do it because its how they make a living.
If there wasnt a market for fur and other animal products then this would happen at all. The sad thing is that people who know that this stuff happens carry on buying fur etc regardless, for no other reason than to look cool (hmmm, your wearing a dead animal round your neck, thats really hmmmm, cool?)
Its just aguess, but Id suggest that NO ONE really wants a job skining animals alive, but some times, jobs are so hard to get that people will do anything to earn a living.
I dunno, maybe when people HAVE to kill an animal for its fur to keep them warm, but to satisfy a market of people who want it as a fasion accsessory, thats exploitative of animals and people.
This post has been edited 1 time(s), it was last edited by TechDiff: 17-06-2006 00:14.
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17-06-2006 00:13 |
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broadside
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| quote: |
Originally posted by cynik
Lol! Did you ever see animals skinning each other?? not. but not because you're living in a city, it's because it's not how nature works. |
Yeah, ok. Not actually skinning each other - altho' im sure you could find some example of something similar, say one crab eating another and using its shell lol i dunno exactly - but i wasn't trying to be that specific. The point was simply that nature is fucking horrible too, and i don't know why people need to see the maltreatment of animals, or rather prioritise the maltreatment of animals, to realise that the world can be a fucked up place.
I'm just ad libbing here, but surely anything that actually happens is natural and how nature works - unless of course you believe in ghosts etc and the supernatural?
Also - genuine question - why don't they kill them first? Surely if it were about the furs they'd be better of just shooting them - i guess ammos expensive - but there are surely less exhausting easier economic ways? It does not look to me like people wearing fur is the problem. We have the ability to kill "humanely", and if an animal has been killed "humanely", controveraislly I don't see why wearing its skin - @ Tech Diff - (which was after all originally a highly practical thing) is any worse than eating its meat. I don't know why those fuckers in the video were doing it that way, but i don't think its really anyone's but their fault. SOme of that shit was just violence for its own sake. DOes anyone know why they DON'T kill them first?
One other thing - there is an issue about the extent to which different animals have the physical capibility to suffer. E.G. There was a big thing not too long ago about people boiling lobsters alive, cos that makes em taste bettter or something, and animals rights people were acting how they do about it, until a scientist stepped in and said that what little nervous system lobsters have becomes completely unfunctional at x degrees of heat, and so they cant feel a thing when they're being boiled, so whats the problem?
Thats an extreme example, but it raises the question of how far we should really project our own capacities for pain (think how much of pains intensity relies on psychological factors) onto animals, and hence how guilty we should feel about chicken batteries, culling etc etc?
before i finish, I'd like to say don't hate me cos I (obviously) do think that that shit in the video was sick, and it should be stopped.
This post has been edited 1 time(s), it was last edited by broadside: 17-06-2006 18:42.
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17-06-2006 18:39 |
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cynik
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yeah then again you're probably a little biased by your own problems with those extreme animal right preservers.
I think they are not killing them first in order to preserve the fur - and to save ammo.
I've known and watched a film where people used rather sick means of killing squirrels.. in order to preserve the fur they inserted an electrode into the anus.. they'd make this awful sound.. but at least it's a quick death as opposed to being skinned alive I guess.
but that is totally idiotic too. why would you require real fur?? in todays scientific age there are better ways of making clothes.
I've got an Eider jacket which is made of gore-tex, and I bet it's more comfortable, warmer yet lighter than any fur-coat, not to mention the price difference. it's entirely made of synthetic materials
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17-06-2006 19:42 |
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equipped
tired
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17-06-2006 22:17 |
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TechDiff
Hetty Jakes Pretentious Cheese Wog
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| quote: |
Originally posted by broadside
| quote: |
Originally posted by cynik
Lol! Did you ever see animals skinning each other?? not. but not because you're living in a city, it's because it's not how nature works. |
Yeah, ok. Not actually skinning each other - altho' im sure you could find some example of something similar, say one crab eating another and using its shell lol i dunno exactly - but i wasn't trying to be that specific. The point was simply that nature is fucking horrible too, and i don't know why people need to see the maltreatment of animals, or rather prioritise the maltreatment of animals, to realise that the world can be a fucked up place.
I'm just ad libbing here, but surely anything that actually happens is natural and how nature works - unless of course you believe in ghosts etc and the supernatural?
Also - genuine question - why don't they kill them first? Surely if it were about the furs they'd be better of just shooting them - i guess ammos expensive - but there are surely less exhausting easier economic ways? It does not look to me like people wearing fur is the problem. We have the ability to kill "humanely", and if an animal has been killed "humanely", controveraislly I don't see why wearing its skin - @ Tech Diff - (which was after all originally a highly practical thing) is any worse than eating its meat. I don't know why those fuckers in the video were doing it that way, but i don't think its really anyone's but their fault. SOme of that shit was just violence for its own sake. DOes anyone know why they DON'T kill them first?
One other thing - there is an issue about the extent to which different animals have the physical capibility to suffer. E.G. There was a big thing not too long ago about people boiling lobsters alive, cos that makes em taste bettter or something, and animals rights people were acting how they do about it, until a scientist stepped in and said that what little nervous system lobsters have becomes completely unfunctional at x degrees of heat, and so they cant feel a thing when they're being boiled, so whats the problem?
Thats an extreme example, but it raises the question of how far we should really project our own capacities for pain (think how much of pains intensity relies on psychological factors) onto animals, and hence how guilty we should feel about chicken batteries, culling etc etc?
before i finish, I'd like to say don't hate me cos I (obviously) do think that that shit in the video was sick, and it should be stopped. |
The reason I think that the fur trade is far worse than the meet trade is because of things like this. The meat trade in the UK is always under strict supervision to ensure that all animals are kept and killed humainly. But the fur tarde seems to be very different. I remember seeing a documentary about mink farming for fur coats. If you think about how small a mink is, and how big a fur coat is, you try to imagine just how many have to be killed just so some rich bloke can give his wife a coat. On the programme the guy who had to kill the mink would walk into a large room full of cages, pick up one of the mink, hold it by the tail and smack its head into the side of a cage. And then repeat the process over and over.
The meat trade on the other hand has some actual use. Its not as though people eat meat as a fashion statement.
Also, artificial fabrics are all good. But for some people they are unaceptible. To some cultures it is very wrong to waste a part of an animal. If an eskimo catches a whale or a bear. They'll use the meat for food, the skin/fur for warmth and building, and the whales blubber will be used for many different things. It seems only fair that if you are gonna kill something then you should honour it by making use of every last bit. They're not gonna use artificial materials instead since it would be dishonourable.
It's strange what cultural differences can provoke. In the UK we are fairly wasteful compared to other european countries. I remember going to france and looking through the window of a butchers and saw pigs ears horse hoofs, and loads of other strange thigs. But Im sure thats its just because its something Id never seen before that it seemed so horrible. The irony is that Im sure Ive eaten all sorts of nasty things. Who knows whats in a BigMac (tm) or a kebab, or even a sausage. Its just the fact that you dont know that protects you. The same could be said of many things. Whether people who like wearing fur honestly dont know where the fur comes from, or whether they just dont care remains to be seen
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17-06-2006 23:16 |
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Muad'Dib
Andrejnalin
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| quote: |
Originally posted by broadside
Yeah, ok. Not actually skinning each other - altho' im sure you could find some example of something similar, say one crab eating another and using its shell lol i dunno exactly - but i wasn't trying to be that specific. The point was simply that nature is fucking horrible too, and i don't know why people need to see the maltreatment of animals, or rather prioritise the maltreatment of animals, to realise that the world can be a fucked up place. |
The problem is not that, but using your intellect (which, if properly used, can provide ways of increasing productivity enough for everyone's survival, so you don't need to skin and take fur to sell it) for plain moronic acts, like killing animal not for food, but for fur.
And also, using your 'developed' brain to cause pain to the animal, instead of doing euthanasia and then use it for what you need it. Why is then forbidden people to torture and kill themselves, and animals can be without any problems? Because they can't say, and they fail to defend themselves by relying on their raw power, and not brain.
That's ok, but it is not necessarily to cause them pain and use their fur for stupid brainless fashion on FTV, when obviously, we won't die if we don't wear fur.
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18-06-2006 02:25 |
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broadside
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tech diff: whether people just don't know where fur comes from or whether they just don't care remains to be seen.
i think its cos they don't care. i mean think about how dumb you'd have to be to not even realise - to some extent - that animals die to make that fur. you may not know or want to think about precisely HOW they die, but you do know they die, you do know fur comes from animals. Beyonce doesnt' care. People just generally don't care.
but i don't think thats quite so stupid. i think that is largely common sense.
Surya said that "we have the choice to ease their suffering". what i've been kind of arguing is that animals probably don't feel - in plain english, their quality of life and death doesn't matter - as much as humans. certainly they are the ultimate "other". and if we can't even treat humans properly (choose your own example), then as for animals . . . forget about it!
and, therefore, stop bashing us over the head about fur and non free range chickens (i mean they are fucking chickens after all) until we sort our own house out first. cos its just pointless. and more than pointless, it takes valuable people away from more useful causes and obscure bigger issues.
leads on to the other basic thing i've been saying, which is kind of nihilistic - thos i aint really nihilistic - which is sort of why the fuck not? i think if you look at nature its survival of the fittest, dog eat dog etc etc. im geting repetetive i realise.
@ cynik, yeah you can get that synthetic coat cheaper, and i guess thats the point, as long as fur is harder to get it will be more popular like gold and platinuum. fashion has never been practical (ie all the royalty wore purple back in the day just because its the hardest colour to extract from nature). I'm sure im stating the obvious. And I agree it would be better if everyone was more sensible. Bit unlikely tho.
Anyhoo, ive had my say. sonl i'll have my computer back and be able to start reviewing and uploading tracks like this site is meant for, and putting out incredibly standard, border line cheesy drum and bass tracks and stop chatting shit
This post has been edited 1 time(s), it was last edited by broadside: 18-06-2006 04:15.
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18-06-2006 03:48 |
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Glim
Stuck In The Late Nineties
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| quote: |
Originally posted by broadside
Anyhoo, ive had my say. sonl i'll have my computer back and be able to start reviewing and uploading tracks like this site is meant for, and putting out incredibly standard, border line cheesy drum and bass tracks and stop chatting shit
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heheh!!
talkin about it in offtopic banter section is safe tho, as for uploadin the track.. cant wait bro..
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18-06-2006 15:16 |
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Greyone
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sick shit 
...
dunno if thats common to their culture but i agree these animals should be killed first, and threatend with some more respect.
if i say a guy doing that...
dunno but he'll regret it , a damn dirty bassballbat to his head instead.
if you look to the vid from a distance , you'll see he's only doing it in front of the camera , probably for a bunch of money.
It dont seems like it is filmed with a hidden camera or something so...
there still are soms sick cunts in this world.
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19-06-2006 09:24 |
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Greyone
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17-07-2006 21:33 |
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D2o
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17-07-2006 21:40 |
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