That fruity kick is nice for a sub presence, then bust out a couple of different kicks like Emblem was saying, eq them the same
i like to clone a kick once or twice and cut the filtering a little and depending if i'm feeling a higher or lower twist, adjust the res. Even this can be done at the end when you have somewhat of a grasp of where your tune is going... you can layer your kicks in to follow the bass somewhat.
I would never use an 808 kick. I have used an 808 w/ a long release w/ some distortion as a bassline though. You need a more punchy kick for DnB. The kick has to cut through the Bass in the mix. In Trance, House, or Rock music, it isn't as crucial, because you dont have the Bassline like you do in DnB. I you use a bass heavy kick, it will muddy up your bottom end w/ your bassline. It's more important to have a strong attack on the kick. Do not boost the bass on the kick. This frequency is already used up in the basslines. It's more of a matter of finding the right accoustic kick and getting the levels correct. The best way to do this is to set your program to loop a small section, perhaps a bar or two. Now solo your bassline and just your kick. Mess with the levels till the kick and bass sound almost like one instrument. Now, mess w/ the release of the kick sound to get it sounding punchy. You dont want it to ring out too much. A good sample shouldnt need too much eq. Basic rule or thumb for any sound is, "crap going in, crap going out". You shouldn't have to change it too much, cuz eq should be used to enhance a good sound, not to make gold outta crap. Also, sidechaining a compressor to your bassline helps. Do do this, add a compressor to your bassline. Now, take the sidechain "in" and connect it to your kick drum. Now, turn the Ratio up the whole way, and turn your Release and Attack the whole way down. You can change these accordingly, but should be set pretty low. Now, everytime your kick hits, the bass line will have a "ducking" effect so that your basslines do not over shadow your kick. This gives you much more punch in your mix. If you are using a drum loop instead of a drum machine, split your channel out of the loop and try boosting the frequency that is most prevelent on your kick, to make it spike in volume when just the kick hits. Now, use this to enter into the sidechain or your compressor. You will get pretty much the same effect. You can also filter out all your highs if you want. Basically, you just want the spike of the kick to trigger the compressor.
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Why don`t u try the drum layering
Some kick with short decay but a lot of attack...
Other kick with long decay, and sustain and no or little attack....+ crash cymbal...and optionaly the compressor seting probably Muad`Dib wrote, but don`t take it for gospel.. use ur ear....
try a high eq-ed kick with a low eq-ed kick
add a hi hat low in the mix
if your using fl when programming kicks DON'T use the sequncer instead use the piano roll and shorten the kick, cancel out any attack or release, eq it to boost the 100-130 hz end {for low kick} anything 60 hz and below cancel out {so the sub has room to breath}
oh yeah add a tiny reverb to the hat thats on the kick, use velocity to make the kicks on every first beat just a tad louder than the kick.
if its a weak kick at soundgoodizer to it and change it to suite.
another thing is analyse a tune or professionally made sample and compare to yours and see where kick is peaking on the spectual analyzer
This post has been edited 3 time(s), it was last edited by ProximityE: 03-12-2010 00:38.
defo @ getting a kick from another tune and comparing it with another track like the above posters..
one thing that can get your track to gel well is use or tune your kick to the key of your track.. ie 86hz for F, 98 hz for G etc..just be sure to notch this out of ur mid-range a bit esp if u decide to boost ur kick at this frequency.
for the low end of layering u can try layering with a really phat low end kick peaking at 40-70hz or so even if u won't use this part of the frequency range when the bassline is playing obviously and hopefully..
gives your kick a rounded phatness...obviously eqing/filtering these two kicks properly is a big part of the equation
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quit being pedantic, just pay attention to what sounds good!
I usually get a few kicks, change the pitch and/or length, record them playing at the same time, and put that recorded sound into a folder for all me dNb sounzzzz. If you're gonna combine kicks, you might want one to provide a 'thud' or sharp attack, another to provide some tone, and another to give a bit of decay to the sound
You can use an ADSR plugin to give that punch at the start,
Personally i use a 13 oct visual analyser on my master bus to see where my kick is hitting and then roll off the bottom from where it starts to drop considerably,
Then i -3dbQ my snares around 180-200hz,
Followed by a quick look at the 13 oct analyser again to see where it starts to drop in the mid-high freqs and give it a nice steady slope down,
Mix the sample down within the eq and bung it through another eq to give the sample more headroom,
This is called serial equalisation =]
I use IXL Inspector and the usual Waves REQ6
The trick is to know when NOT to compress ;]
For adding punch I would say lower de mids a couple of dB, one band high BW, and maybe boost a couple of dB where it hits in de low end (Frooty Parametric EQ2 shows the peaks well enough for me).
If you want a fast drum, you want it to 'cut through the mix', since the low end in a kick has a relatively slow attack to it, it's not really clear when it hits exaclty so you need the high end to do that for you (layering higher hats or whitenoise, or exciting or....).
Thanks, but that isn't an answer to the question "how to get your kicks right?" it's more a thing of frequencies and punch and oomph and layering and sidechaining.
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So I'm probably saying what others have already said, but just so I'm covering all the areas I think are important:
As the old saying goes (you can't polish a turd etc) use the best hi quality samples as possible, I normally layer 2 kicks at the very most nowadays (with possibly a 3rd kick from an actual break) but yeah 1 lower "boomier" type sound with more low end / low mids and a 2nd "punchier" sound with more mids / hi mids. both layers eq'd separately taking out what isn't needed in both and bringing out the frequencies that you need to in both as well (which in turn depends on what samples you've used).
I'll then combine these layers and process them once again as a whole with some more careful EQing and also compression to give them that compact edge. With compressing kicks I normally keep a fairly fast attack (15 - 20ms) and I'll adjust the ratio and threshold depending on how the kick works in the mix with all the other elements. Compression is a good way of getting your kicks boxey and compact without needing to push the overall volume too hard.
Generally the boost at 70 - 110hz will give you a nice punch although, for me the best tip i can give is just to make sure you don't have tooo much low end in ur kick, i always find that especially when you have a sub underneath it you can actually save a lot of headroom by taking out some of the 30 - 60hz area from the kick. Here again just be careful not to take too much low end out so that your kick ends up sounding tiny, its just about acheiving a good balance. Also sidechaining - not necessarily to the bass but also to the various percussion layers can definately help define it more and pop out that extra bit.
Another little tip is to use a sharp cut on your sub bass where you kick is peaking (70 - 110hz or wherever it happens to be), with this you may not really need to sidechain your bass and kick they can happily sit together in the mix.
agreed with ketz, find good samples, layer them eq them right (as explained here many times)
and use your ears to judge whats best, or get another pair of ears to help you.
goodluck
I started out with this problem, try to sample kicks from places like loopmasters, where dnb artists post their samples. If you're feeling creative and less lazy then take that techno kick and layer a dirtier kick over the top and eq the top layers freq's around where the techno kick peaks. Good tip : choose samples with the same sustain length, if you layer a quick attacking kick with a longer one, it will sound flabby
