 akura - Sticky Bandit |
Surya 
The Robot
Registration Date: 04-11-2002
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They use Reason...
Already told you: like it, very well made. You guys have a tremendous eye for detail. This track is absolutely packed with details all over with still having a clear structure and stuff. Very well done!
Bassline is very nice, drums are very well done, with lots of stuff in there.
Love the extra distorted bassline with the varying EQ somewhere to the end. Phat
The part after that could have been a bit longer. Don't be afraid to use the same variation twice, since no one will notice 
Listened on headphones, will give comments on your sub volume later.
EDIT: Seems like you worked out the right volume for the sub now, I think it's quite allright. All the rest sounds crisp and shit. A bit more mid on your drums wouldn't hurt, but nothing drastic.
4/5
Hope to see the next one sooner
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"In dnb you should make people jump not swim"
- Pieter Frenssen 2004
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01-07-2004 10:49 |
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thechronic
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Registration Date: 01-11-2002
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I like it 
It doesn't have the same wowfactor as Kelderkracht (mainly due to the absence of a killer lead imo) but it's a very well made track that flows nicely.
This track is really interesting to listen to, especially after you heard it a couple of times already. There are really a LOT of different elements in it and a lot of stuff happening. Must have been a formidable task putting this together 
OK now that you know that I figure it's a good track I'll get down and dirty with some tough remarks on the technical aspects of the mix, I know you guys got the talent and good ideas but a bit of a lack of mixdown theory
- ease up a bit on the reverb 
- isn't the sub too much? Hard to tell on my 10" speakers but they seem to struggle to get out of their cabinets.
- The main kickdrum is a bit too muffled sounding I think, I'm more into clearly defined kick sounds, but that's a personal preference
Especially in the beginning of the track the kick is clearly audible and it sounds a bit like the microphone was placed too close to the drum skin and it's being hit by it so you get a doubled kick sound. In modern dnb the kick has lost a bit of importance but it's still a driving force for every track imo and should sound kickin good 
If I'm not mistaken there are two kick drums in there, one coming in from time to time in a 4 to the floor pattern and sounding louder and deeper. There are also some kick like sounds in there more used as percussion. Try never playing two kick sounds together, eg when you play a loop that has a kick in it, cut it out every time your main kick plays. That will clear up the sound big time.
edit: on listening again I really think you've got some kicks layered, try if you can change that somehow, just keep the best kick every time you layer them and cut or filter out the other kick(s).
- maybe find a way of combining the sub and the kick, I think it would sound great if every note of the sub was played together with the kick drum, so that the sub sounds like an extension of the kick. Find a kick that really complements the sub and compress them together.
For an example of this listen to the part that starts at 3:06 (minimalistic with only a break and a reece) > the moments that the kick is played at the start of a reece note makes the reece sound much powerful. The kick also plays sometimes in the middle of a reece note and that's OK, but there are a couple of reece notes that are played without a kick (every second note and the one at 3:25) and that just doesn't sound the same.
The sub bass would benefit in the same way. This would imply to make the kick patterns a bit simpler and more predictable but that would be a good trade off I think for the added punch you would get to the sub.
- the stereo image is very elaborately done, a lot of things are moving around but some elements should be a little bit different. As long as your kicks and basses stay in the centre you can do anything, but you have to be careful. The sound that could definitely use a different stereo treatment is the Lead (introduced at 0:33) which has a dynamic widening/narrowing effect on it but could better just move. I recently mixed a psytrance cd that had dozens of wide leads in it and I learned a big lesson: leads should be close to mono! Pan it around as much as you like and you can put stereo delays etc on it but as soon that it gets wider it loses definition and focus. In general, leads should be in your face, not swimming around in the stereo width. It's OK to make background stuff wide though.
- Master compression should be tweaked very carefully. Now it sounds like you just slapped on a hard mastering compressor preset or something.
During short breaks the apparent change in volume is so drastic it almost becomes scary (eg at 3:03). Also listen to the low end between 2:11 and 2:20 - the subs are squashing the kick, so that the kick seems to gain power as soon as the subs stop. This can be solved with carefully eqing the kick and sub so that they complement eachother instead of fighting for the same frequencies.
- the wah wah sound at 1:16 is too loud and could use some eq, it's very dominant around 500-700 Hz (sounds 'honky')
- there's something strange going on with the main snare drum stereo position. I think it blends in with a part of the moving percussion so it appears to shift to the right sometimes. Again a matter of carefully eqing to seperate them.
OK well I'm sorry if this looks like I'm being too tough on you guys but I think that this track has a lot of potential and just needs to be polished up a bit
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If you find spam on the site, please hit the  button and select my name. I'll personally kick it to the murky depths of hell where it belongs! 
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01-07-2004 12:18 |
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Surya
The Robot
Registration Date: 04-11-2002
Posts: 11,238
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O Pieter toch!
Those guys have worked SO hard on thisone, especially the mastering. I think Akura spend a few weeks only on the mastering, to get it just right. He knows more about mastering than I do. I always just trust my ears, and thats it
He's done a lot of research on a lot of matters to get them right.
I know your comments are right and well intended, I just hope Akura isn't too dissapointed after spending that much time on the mastering...
And I've never seen SUCH a long review by anyone on this board
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"In dnb you should make people jump not swim"
- Pieter Frenssen 2004
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01-07-2004 12:38 |
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thechronic
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Registration Date: 01-11-2002
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But it doesn't SOUND right 
Just check those two points I quoted...
Oh djeez sorry Akura...
BTW I also do mastering completely by ear, and it does take a long time to get right. Use good gear. And remember, less is more.
The threshold on the mastering compressor should be higher on this track so the low volume sounds don't get boosted so much, or you could lower the thresh and then lower the ratio too to below 2:1. The low end problem needs to be solved by individually EQing the sub and kick, nothing can be done about that using mastering gear, but the way it is mastered makes this problem more apparent.
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If you find spam on the site, please hit the button and select my name. I'll personally kick it to the murky depths of hell where it belongs!
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01-07-2004 12:50 |
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Surya
The Robot
Registration Date: 04-11-2002
Posts: 11,238
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Yeah, I know that you won't say this if there aren't any problems. After all, you're still the pro
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"In dnb you should make people jump not swim"
- Pieter Frenssen 2004
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01-07-2004 14:04 |
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Akura
Kletsenboem-style
Registration Date: 06-04-2003
Posts: 223
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Wow that was a serious chunk to read!
First of all, thanks to everyone who already left comments (not even one day far and already a lot to read, I'm flattered
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Surya, indeed I did work big time to get this right (but not on the final compressing). I'm not disappointed by the comments of Thechronic on the contrary it gives me more courage to turn this one into a acceptable result.
Thechronic thanks to put in the energy to give me these very usefull remarks!
The technical remarks from thechronic:
About master compression. I was so anxious to post my work that I didn't spent energy on the master compression, and idd (especially the mp3-version) it sounds well over-compressed.
I did work a long time (most of the time experimenting) on the sub-volume, I hope this fits fairly right (my monitors and hifi-speakers don't have much trouble with them).
All the other remarks: I'll spend the necessary attention to them (already solved al lot of similar troubles before I launched this track but there are idd still quite a lot of troubles left). I think by using quite a lot of sounds I made it myself not that easy
After dealing with the technical aspects I might consider using your tips concerning composition Surya. They're good tips
but I hope I have the courage then to work on it further.
Bongzilla, this track is completely made in Reason like Surya told. I just used a link with Nuendo to be able to insert some VST-EQ's. As you can derive Reason doesn't give you the possibility to insert VST-modules... a shame!
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01-07-2004 20:34 |
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Surora23
Agressive Melodic Disorder
Registration Date: 05-07-2004
Posts: 2,127
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this song is fairly good...but i look for aspects of mixing capability...(not judging by my own work) BUT the begging could be more progressive...but the bassline is fucking sick...i love it...to be honest i tried to emulate something similar and couldnt do it...(softwear sucks balls) but the bassline is fat...also the song jsut seems to end...maybe cause im used to the progressive dnb songs cause i mix them, but then again...no one wants to wait another 1.5 mins for a song to end just because it was made to be mixed...i like this song deff... i give it a 4
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Rinse it OUT!!!! 
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08-07-2004 19:10 |
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) )!