I've just watched this new video by Michael Shermer on the Richard Dawkins YouTube channel. It's about critical thinking and detecting unfounded and unscientific claims. He mentions UFO's a few times, although what he says applies to everybody, so it's probably worth mentioning it in this thread. It's a very good vid.
__ MySpace | Soundcloud | Drumnbass.be | Facebook "It is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring." Carl Sagan
Originally posted by Greyone
what i ment with my "evolution + creationism" thought
You probably know this already but be very careful not to take "Expelled" too seriously. There was a lot of quote-mining going on which made it appear that Dawkins was giving credence to creationism. Needless to say, he was not, and never has done. Whether it was intentional or not (I happen to think that it probably was intentional), it was very deceptive. Here's a video from Dawkins about it.
By the way, those other two videos by Dawkins were great.
That is the same approach that I would take on the possibility of life elsewhere in the universe.
__ MySpace | Soundcloud | Drumnbass.be | Facebook "It is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring." Carl Sagan
Originally posted by Greyone
what i ment with my "evolution + creationism" thought
You probably know this already but be very careful not to take "Expelled" too seriously. There was a lot of quote-mining going on which made it appear that Dawkins was giving credence to creationism. Needless to say, he was not, and never has done. Whether it was intentional or not (I happen to think that it probably was intentional), it was very deceptive. Here's a video from Dawkins about it.
By the way, those other two videos by Dawkins were great.
That is the same approach that I would take on the possibility of life elsewhere in the universe.
good , well don't think im a ufo freak or so now
i am just curious about the subject and I know there is alot not talked about by government and news
i saw expelled a long time ago and it was the first time i saw dawkins , but indeed i felt he was pressed in a corner because of that other bimbo
anyway, this morning , a beatifull blue sky , when i went down and checked the east side where the sun was risin , the sky was filled with contrails from planes , when further examining the contrails they were spreading out and formed some kind of maze or screen in front of the sun.
Its not the first time i see this and there is alot of disscusion around this , i searched all over the net and indeed found good explanations why this is so ...
I dont know if you are familiar with the object , but u might be interested or look into your skies too , on a very blue sky day..
I am aware of this , cause im home now since i graduated
(i have to sollicitate this afternoon) and i did alot! of research about what is realy going on in this world , thats when i also find interesting vids about zeitgeist discussed alot of things with smart ass friends who were also locked on the subject.
blablalba , just know , that the rabithole is deeper then u think it is , there is alot of shit spread out on the net for shure , but there is ALOT not even discussed about and flattly ignored by high ranked persons , that is important for u to know...
oh and the subject of the spreading contrails , are called chemtrails but has given a bad name by debunkers and its better to search on "aerosol particles"
why cant i find much info about Clark C. McClelland (apolo 11 Spacecraft Operator) on youtube or google ?
McClelland did work for NASA. He was trained as a Spacecraft Operator (not an astronaut). He may have worked as one for a very brief time before he was "let go".
Before he was with NASA he worked in the space program for various subcontractors. His name and affiliations are listed on the Mercury and Apollo monuments as haven taken part (along with every other person).
(just something i found , might be fake too )
the point is:
"The more info i find the less i believe ,
the only things i trust now are my family , my friends , and the people i love .
Everything is manipulated , it allways have been and will always (hope not) be .
Why are we working with google anyway ... because its the best browser ? no because its the search browser from the company with most money , who is owned and ownes other companies , and is influenced and influences others. has a big name blablabla...
Same for youtube , same for that stupid wikipedia , and same for the school education , same for the news , same for the papers ...
It's all the fucking same kapitalistic scumbags who have the money and the power to tell you what they want in order to keep the public unaware and keep the economy rolling with everybody in its place doing their thing.
And yet we need this society and the way it works if we want to use it for or own luxury , and thats the ironical point of it all."
You can verify these are earth made weapons/craft by visiting the NEW YORK TIMES ARCHIVES.
Dec 14 1944. "Mystery Ball new Nazi Weapon" dec 14 1944. NYT
The article talks all about them,
"Spheres are incountered individually or in clusters..."
Wake up to the realities from before your time.
This IS the future, they just hide the cool toys.
quote:
Current Science and Aviation USA, January 22, 1945 "Foo-Fighters".
Newsweek USA, January 15, 1945 "Foo-Fighters", different types.
The Era USA, January 2, 1945 "Foo-Fighter" joins weird fight in skies".
The New York Times USA, December 14, 1944 "Floating mystery ball is new german weapon" Foo Fighters "explained" as new german weapon.
On August 10, 1944 over the Indian Ocean, the co-pilot of a U.S. Army Air Force B-29 Superfortress heavy bomber reported that: "A strange object was pacing us about 500 yards [475 m.] off the starboard wing. At that distance it appeared as a spherical object, probably five or six feet [1_ - 2 m.] in diameter, of a very bright and intense red or orange... it seemed to have a halo effect. "My gunner reported it coming in from about a 5 o'clock position (right rear) at our level. It seemed to throb or vibrate constantly. Assuming it was some kind of radio-controlled object sent to pace us, I went into evasive action, changing direction constantly, as much as 90 degrees and altitude of about 2,000 feet [600 m.]. It followed our every maneuver for about eight minutes, always holding a position about 500 yards [475 m.] out and about 2 o'clock (right front) in relation to the plane. When it left, it made an abrupt 90 degree turn, accelerating rapidly, and disappeared into the overcast."
(Clark, Jerome, and Farish, Lucius, "The Mysterious 'Foo Fighters' of World War II," in '1977 UFO Annual'.
Hagenau Germany December 1944:
On December 22, 1944 over Hagenau, Germany, the pilot and radar operator of an American night fighter encountered two "large orange glows" which climbed rapidly towards them. When the pilot dove steeply and banked sharply, the objects stayed with him. The pilot stated: "Upon reaching our altitude, they levelled off and stayed on my tail... After two minutes, they peeled off and turned away, flying under perfect control."
(Clark, Jerome, and Farish, Lucius, "The Mysterious 'Foo Fighters' of World War II," in '1977 UFO Annual'.
Aired October 4th - Director and host James Fox assembles the most credible UFO witnesses from around the world to testify on the subject and share their experiences and observations. Air Force generals, astronauts, military and commercial pilots, government and FAA officials from seven countries gather at the National Press Club in Washington D.C. to tell stories that, as former Arizona governor Fife Symington states, will challenge your reality. These accounts reveal a behind-the-scenes U.S. operation whose policy, in the eyes of some observers, seems to involve confiscation of substantiating evidence from close encounters--to the extent that even Presidents have failed to get straight answers.
The DOD is developing a parallel to Planet Earth,
with billions of individual "nodes" to reflect every man,
woman, and child this side of the dividing line between reality and AR.
Called the Sentient World Simulation (SWS), it will be a
"synthetic mirror of the real world with automated
continuous calibration with respect to current real-world information",
according to a concept paper for the project.
After hundreds of years of detailed observation and study, our closest companion in the vast universe, Earth’s moon, remains an enigma. Six moon landings and hundreds of experiments have resulted in more questions being asked than answered. Among them:
1. Moon’s Age: The moon is far older than previously expected. Maybe even older than the Earth or the Sun. The oldest age for the Earth is estimated to be 4.6 billion years old; moon rocks were dated at 5.3 billion years old, and the dust upon which they were resting was at least another billion years older.
2. Rock’s Origin: The chemical composition of the dust upon which the rocks sat differed remarkably from the rocks themselves, contrary to accepted theories that the dust resulted from weathering and breakup of the rocks themselves. The rocks had to have come from somewhere else.
3. Heavier Elements on Surface: Normal planetary composition results in heavier elements in the core and lighter materials at the surface; not so with the moon. According to Wilson,
"The abundance of refractory elements like titanium in the surface areas is so pronounced that several geologists proposed the refractory compounds were brought to the moon’s surface in great quantity in some unknown way. They don’t know how, but that it was done cannot be questioned."
4. Water Vapor: On March 7, 1971, lunar instruments placed by the astronauts recorded a vapor cloud of water passing across the surface of the moon. The cloud lasted 14 hours and covered an area of about 100 square miles.
5. Magnetic Rocks: Moon rocks were magnetized. This is odd because there is no magnetic field on the moon itself. This could not have originated from a "close call" with Earth—such an encounter would have ripped the moon apart.
6. No Volcanoes: Some of the moon’s craters originated internally, yet there is no indication that the moon was ever hot enough to produce volcanic eruptions.
7. Moon Mascons: Mascons, which are large, dense, circular masses lying twenty to forty miles beneath the centers of the moon’s maria,
"are broad, disk-shaped objects that could be possibly some kind of artificial construction. For huge circular disks are not likely to be beneath each huge maria, centered like bull’s-eyes in the middle of each, by coincidence or accident."
8. Seismic Activity: Hundreds of "moonquakes" are recorded each year that cannot be attributed to meteor strikes. In November, 1958, Soviet astronomer Nikolay A. Kozyrev of the Crimean Astrophysical Observatory photographed a gaseous eruption of the moon near the crater Alphonsus. He also detected a reddish glow that lasted for about an hour. In 1963, astronomers at the Lowell Observatory also saw reddish glows on the crests of ridges in the Aristarchus region. These observations have proved to be precisely identical and periodical, repeating themselves as the moon moves closer to the Earth. These are probably not natural phenomena.
9. Hollow Moon: The moon’s mean density is 3.34 gm/cm3 (3.34 times an equal volume of water) whereas the Earth’s is 5.5. What does this mean? In 1962, NASA scientist Dr. Gordon MacDonald stated,
"If the astronomical data are reduced, it is found that the data require that the interior of the moon is more like a hollow than a homogeneous sphere."
Nobel chemist Dr. Harold Urey suggested the moon’s reduced density is because of large areas inside the moon where is "simply a cavity."
MIT’s Dr. Sean C. Solomon wrote,
"the Lunar Orbiter experiments vastly improved our knowledge of the moon’s gravitational field... indicating the frightening possibility that the moon might be hollow."
In Carl Sagan’s treatise, Intelligent Life in the Universe, the famous astronomer stated, "A natural satellite cannot be a hollow object."
10. Moon Echoes: On November 20, 1969, the Apollo 12 crew jettisoned the lunar module ascent stage causing it to crash onto the moon. The LM’s impact (about 40 miles from the Apollo 12 landing site) created an artificial moonquake with startling characteristics—the moon reverberated like a bell for more than an hour.
This phenomenon was repeated with Apollo 13 (intentionally commanding the third stage to impact the moon), with even more startling results. Seismic instruments recorded that the reverberations lasted for three hours and twenty minutes and traveled to a depth of twenty-five miles, leading to the conclusion that the moon has an unusually light—or even no—core.
11. Unusual Metals: The moon’s crust is much harder than presumed. Remember the extreme difficulty the astronauts encountered when they tried to drill into the maria? Surprise! The maria is composed primarily illeminite, a mineral containing large amounts of titanium, the same metal used to fabricate the hulls of deep-diving submarines and the skin of the SR-71 "Blackbird". Uranium 236 and neptunium 237 (elements not found in nature on Earth) were discovered in lunar rocks, as were rustproof iron particles.
12. Moon’s Origin: Before the astronauts’ moon rocks conclusively disproved the theory, the moon was believed to have originated when a chunk of Earth broke off eons ago (who knows from where?). Another theory was that the moon was created from leftover "space dust" remaining after the Earth was created. Analysis of the composition of moon rocks disproved this theory also.
Another popular theory is that the moon was somehow "captured" by the Earth’s gravitational attraction. But no evidence exists to support this theory. Isaac Asimov, stated,
"It’s too big to have been captured by the Earth. The chances of such a capture having been effected and the moon then having taken up nearly circular orbit around our Earth are too small to make such an eventuality credible."
13. Weird Orbit: Our moon is the only moon in the solar system that has a stationary, near-perfect circular orbit. Stranger still, the moon’s center of mass is about 6000 feet closer to the Earth than its geometric center (which should cause wobbling), but the moon’s bulge is on the far side of the moon, away from the Earth. "Something" had to put the moon in orbit with its precise altitude, course, and speed.
14. Moon Diameter: How does one explain the "coincidence" that the moon is just the right distance, coupled with just the right diameter, to completely cover the sun during an eclipse? Again, Isaac Asimov responds,
"There is no astronomical reason why the moon and the sun should fit so well. It is the sheerest of coincidences, and only the Earth among all the planets is blessed in this fashion."
15. Spaceship Moon: As outrageous as the Moon-Is-a-Spaceship Theory is, all of the above items are resolved if one assumes that the moon is a gigantic extraterrestrial craft, brought here eons ago by intelligent beings. This is the only theory that is supported by all of the data, and there are no data that contradict this theory.
Greek authors Aristotle and Plutarch, and Roman authors Apolllonius Rhodius and Ovid all wrote of a group of people called the Proselenes who lived in the central mountainous area of Greece called Arcadia. The Proselenes claimed title to this area because their forebears were there "before there was a moon in the heavens."
This claim is substantiated by symbols on the wall of the Courtyard of Kalasasaya, near the city of Tiahuanaco, Bolivia, which record that the moon came into orbit around the Earth between 11,500 and 13, 000 years ago, long before recorded history.
1. Ages of Flashes: Aristarchus, Plato, Eratosthenes, Biela, Rabbi Levi, and Posidonius all reported anomalous lights on the moon. NASA, one year before the first lunar landing, reported 570+ lights and flashes were observed on the moon from 1540 to 1967.
2. Operation Moon Blink: NASA’s Operation Moon Blink detected 28 lunar events in a relatively short period of time.
3. Lunar Bridge: On July 29, 1953, John J. O’Neill observed a 12-mile-long bridge straddling the crater Mare Crisium. In August, British astronomer Dr. H.P. Wilkens verified its presence,
"It looks artificial. It’s almost incredible that such a thing could have been formed in the first instance, or if it was formed, could have lasted during the ages in which the moon has been in existence."
4. The Shard: The Shard, an obelisk-shaped object that towers 1½ miles from the Ukert area of the moon’s surface, was discovered by Orbiter 3 in 1968. Dr. Bruce Cornet, who studied the amazing photographs, stated,
"No known natural process can explain such a structure."
5. The Tower: One of the most curious features ever photographed on the Lunar surface (Lunar Orbiter photograph III-84M) is an amazing spire that rises more than 5 miles from the Sinus Medii region of the lunar surface.
6. The Obelisks: Lunar Orbiter II took several photographs in November 1966 that showed several obelisks, one of which was more than 150 feet tall.
". . . the spires were arranged in precisely the same was as the apices of the three great pyramids."
Moon Statistics
Mass (kg) = 7.349e+22
Mass (Earth = 1) = 1.2298e-02
Equatorial radius (km) = 1,737.4
Equatorial radius (Earth = 1) = 2.7241e-01
Mean density (gm/cm^3) = 3.34
Mean distance from Earth (km) = 384,400
Rotational period (days) = 27.32166
Orbital period (days) = 27.32166
Average length of lunar day (days) = 29.53059
Mean orbital velocity (km/sec) = 1.03
Orbital eccentricity = 0.0549
Tilt of axis (degrees) = 1.5424
Orbital inclination (degrees) = 5.1454
Equatorial surface gravity (m/sec^2) = 1.62
Equatorial escape velocity (km/sec) = 2.38
Visual geometric albedo = 0.12
Magnitude (Vo) = -12.74
Mean surface temperature (day) = 107°C
Mean surface temperature (night) = -153°C
Maximum surface temperature = 123°C
Minimum surface temperature = -233°C
That is the same approach that I would take on the possibility of life elsewhere in the universe.
